As the Open University announces its fees for new students in England, here's a place to share your thoughts or plans...
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Robyn Bateman (member of the Platform team)
David Aikin - Mon, 25/07/2011 - 19:50
Note to self - I will not make unfriendly comments about Nick Clegg
Though fee increases are never welcome, I think a degree for £15K isn't as bad as it could have been...
I like that part-time study will be proprortionally priced - half of the study for half of the fee...
As a current student, I like the transitional arrangements.
I was wondering if the new fees apply to all courses equally?
What about courses like business and law - will a 60 point/credit course in these subjects be £2,500 or will fees be higher?
I'm a law student - so I'm kind of curious.
EDIT 25.07.11: Just got an email from Open University General Enquiries. For those interested in law courses with the OU, the 2012 fees for law modules are also set at £2,500 - not cheap, but as law modules in the past have been more expensive than other subjects, the fee doesn't seem too bad.....
Joanna Mackenzie - Wed, 20/07/2011 - 23:16
I'm interested in how they are going to manage to get the large number of career changers who did their first degrees ten or twenty years ago. The new loan system states that you cannot have a degree in order to be eligible. A large number of OU students have already got a first degree, so without these students the OU is going to struggle.
I am glad I am just coming to the end of my degree but I feel sorry for all those people who are unhappy in their current jobs or have experienced a decline in their sector and now cannot afford to have a career change. I am sure we will see an increase in rates of depression in the years to come from this change.
Ivan Riera Sanchez - Thu, 21/07/2011 - 07:46
Some people won't be able to study with the new fees, so that is so sad...
this increase is applied to the postgrade studies too?
Yvonne Cook - Thu, 21/07/2011 - 11:23
No, the changes to higher education funding affect only undergraduate courses in England. If you go to http://www8.open.ac.uk/study/explained/fees-2012/new-to-study and look down the page you'll find more information about postgraduate funding and the new fees in general.
Yvonne
Platform team
Hayley Motteram - Fri, 22/07/2011 - 08:53
How does distance learning, where one tutorial per month (if that at times) and a set of books/cds cost £2,500? Putting up the cost more than three times than the original price is disgusting.
As a Young Student Ambassador I am concerned that the OU have no idea how much this will affect younger students. I have questioned a few students from my old secondary school since hearing this, and they all said this:
"Why would I want to spend £5,000 a year for studying at home, irregular contact with tutors and hardly any face to face interaction with students, when I can pay a bit more and get so much more at campus universities? I thought the OU was a more economical way of getting a degree?"
It's sad but true - the gap between the cost of an OU degree and a campus uni degree is getting narrower, and the OU will pay for it, big time.
Caz Walton - Mon, 25/07/2011 - 13:19
Hayley, I agree with what you're saying, just at a point where The OU was seeming like an affordable alternative for many younger students this happens.
I do however think that the student who made the comment about paying a little more to go to a campus university needs to remember that even at £5k per year (FTE) The OU is still 45% cheaper than the highest charging universities (of which there are an increasing amount!) so The OU is STILL by far the most affordable alternative.
I'm hoping this will actually work in The OU's favour. Percentage differences between OU and brick unis are still similar but in terms of actual hard earned (or worse borrowed!) £££'s the gap has suddenly shot up from £1800 to £4000 per YEAR. That's a difference of £12000 over a 3 year degree, that's a year's salary for some people!!
I really do think we need to be mindful of that fact. Does that student you questionned really want to pay an extra £12000 PLUS accommodation fees and living expenses just to be able to have a bit more of a social life? I wouldn't.
Andrew Boyd - Thu, 28/07/2011 - 18:33
It's not just for a 'bit more of a social life' though is it? It's access to all the brick uni facilities as opposed to sitting at home ready a book.
I was lucky enough to get a OU degree a couple of years ago. In a couple of years from now my kids will be uni age. There is no way I will allow them to pay £5K a year for what the OU has to offer.
The whole big debt thing is a bit misleading isn't it? If you owe £15K for a OU degree or £30K for a 'proper' degree the monthly repayments are the same. Only differnce is you will probably clear the OU debt within the 30 year limit while the 'big' debt will be wiped after this time anyway.
Caz Walton - Fri, 29/07/2011 - 13:26
It's not just for a 'bit more of a social life' though is it? It's access to all the brick uni facilities as opposed to sitting at home ready a book
What extra facilities do brick unis offer? Let's look at your list of L's and see where they differ from The OU:
Lectures - Well The OU DOES offer lectures (tutorials) and due to the nature of The OU they're tailored to suit part time students in that they're usually out of normal working hours or online. The OU was never designed to cater itself predominantly for full time students the same way a brick uni does...
Lecturers - What do my module tutors and central academics do all day then if they're not lecturers? Are they not there to help me and answer any queries I have regarding the module?
Libraries - As an OU student you can get access to ANY library within the COUNTRY if you so desire, so aside from the online library and the one at Walton Hall I, for example, could borrow books from Newcastle University Library. If you don't believe me check here http://library.open.ac.uk/help/otherlibs/index.cfm
Laboratories - admittedly this is a more limited one, but there's residential courses for those academic fields which may require lab time so provisions ARE attempted...
I think you're missing the entire point of The OU here though, it's not meant to be the same as a brick university, it's not aimed at the same market so the competition it has with brick unis is limited. It's designed for folks like me who work full time, don't have the time or financial freedom to be able to attend a brick uni but who still want the opportunity to study and earn a qualification in the time around the more important commitments.
This isn't aimed at you in particular, but I'm already fed up of people saying they're disappointed in the OU for what THEY'VE put fees up by. Let's clarify something here - this wasn't The OU's doing, it was the governments... The OU didn't have a choice in the matter.
However, for those cynics among you who'd like to know where the £2500 for a 60 pointer is derived from I may just have to waggle my OUSA wand and see if we can get a breakdown of costs so we can settle that debate once and for all
Tony Salmon - Wed, 03/08/2011 - 17:28
I have to agree with Hayley's comment. With the PT fees up at £2500 for the provision of the book, DVD, online stuff, limited access to a tutor, no bricks and mortar for those who live a long way from Milton Keynes and marking of assignments - how can that fee be justified?
Most of the material is self-taught with nothing more than a sophisticated distance learning arrangement.
PT study with the OU is seriously going to be impacted. If this was the fee for my last year then I wouldn't have started in the first place.
Could spell the end of this part of the OU.
Robyn Bateman - Fri, 22/07/2011 - 09:39
This comment from Nikki on her blog seems to sum up the general feeling…
"I have to be honest… these changes anger me. I am not, in any way, angry at the OU. These changes will not affect me. But I am angry for the group of kids who happen to be a couple of years younger than me and will pay over twice as much for the same standard of education that I received. I am angry at the government who received their education for free. I feel our generation is being left behind by previous generations who had everything handed to them on a golden platter."
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Robyn Bateman (member of the Platform team)
Joanne Beardsley - Fri, 22/07/2011 - 13:14
I must admit I was really shocked to see how much the new fees are. I think this will put off a lot of potential students. If the fees had been this high when I started my degree there is no way I could have afforded it. I think that the OU will really struggle to attract students.
Jo
Nigel Plumridge - Sun, 24/07/2011 - 10:59
Paying 5/8th or 5/9th of the fees expected from a traditional University is a very high proportion. Time will tell whether this is low enough to convince young students to opt for what the OU can offer, that is printed text, online support and occasional tutorials.
I imagine that this will, for most, be a poor second choice to actually attending University with all it has to offer, both inside and outside of the lectures. The student experience of 'attending' uni will be lost to those who opt for the OU.
Karen Broadribb - Tue, 26/07/2011 - 09:05
I'm told the OU has yet to make a decision on the new fee level for 10- and 15-point courses, but if they rise in proportion to the 30- and 60-pointers, i.e. by about x3.5, we could be looking at fees of £500-£700 just for an Openings course or a brief "taster". Who on earth is going to want - or be able to afford - that?
The reply I had from the OU seemed to work on the assumption that the majority of students who took these courses did them as one-offs or as a hobby interest, and reminded me that the revised fee structure is focused towards certificates, degrees and diplomas. The OU seems to be overlooking the point that many of these short courses can be counted towards the various certificates (e.g. Certificate of Higher Education in...) and even the Open BA, provided they don't account for more than 30 points at Level 1.
Also, does anybody see the much-mismanaged Tesco vouchers scheme continuing after September 2012? Or even continuing to provide practical financial support? At the moment, as a small-time Tesco Express shopper, I can build up £50-worth of vouchers over a two-year period, giving me £150 off a short course currently costing £170-£195. After September 2012, £150 off will scarcely make a dent for new students.
I really do feel that the new fee structure will penalise the very people who historically have most needed the OU: those on low incomes, striving to give themselves a second chance.
This is undoubtedly the darkest and most shameful hour in the OU's existence.
Patrick Mcguire - Tue, 26/07/2011 - 20:05
Well, so much for the 'Open' university! How 'open' is a fee of £2500? If fees had been at this level when I was with the OU I would never have started, and I think this is going to be the attitude of many in my situation, ie, working a nine to five ordinary job for a very average wage, but with an interest in developing a liking for history and literature. At, I think, £600 for a sixty point course in 2006 the OU system was a bargain. Now the 'not wanted' signs are going up at the OU for those very people it was first intended to attract! For some £2500 won't be a worry, for many more it is going to be a major disincentive. What a shame.
Andrew Boyd - Thu, 28/07/2011 - 18:19
This new pricing is absolutely ridiculous. Someone doing two 60 point courses is going to have to pay £5,000?
It’s bad enough having to pay that sort of price for a full years education at a proper university, but at least that gets you access to all the facilities a ‘bricks and mortar’ uni has to offer. For example -
Lectures
Lecturers
Libraries
Laboratories
And that’s just the Ls.
What will the OU offer in return for this massive increase? Local evening tutorial several times a week? No? Didn’t think so.
The OU seems to think it will attract 'full time' students as the fees are lower than the top end uni's. But who is going to pay £5K to sit at home and read some books? Young students are more interested the the uni lifstyle than qualifications. S
I think this will be the beginning of the end for the OU.
Colin Cutter - Tue, 02/08/2011 - 10:36
David Cameron will now achieve what the Thatcher Government did not - the beginning of the end of the Open University.
Helen Ward - Tue, 02/08/2011 - 15:34
I never thought that I would end up praising Margaret Thatcher on a public forum but ...
"Her most remarkable achievment" [ as Education Secratary] "was saving the Open University. The Tories in opposition had sneered at the projected 'university of the air' as a typical Wilsonian gimmick. Nor only Macleod, but even Boyle, had intended to scrap it. The libertariabn right ... regarded the OU as an unnecessary extension of state provision. But Mrs Thatcher ... was pursuaded, principally by Walter Perry - the OU's first Vice Chancellor - that it was a serious and worthwhile enterprise that would genuinely extend opportunity." (Campbell, 2007, p.229)
Campbell J., 2007, Margaret Thatcher Volume One : The Grocer's Daughter, London : Vintage Books
Colin Cutter - Tue, 02/08/2011 - 22:11
In response to the above:
Please note that I referred to "Mrs Thatcher's Government" not to the lady herself. It was the Government that offfered the choice between School Milk or the OU. I would heartily endorse your praise for her in that respect - an institution was saved at minor cost to most of the parents affected by the loss of school milk.
With fees now more than tripled, the nature of this world renowned institution must irrevocably change. Whilst the OU may well offer a cheaper and attractive option for "live at home" students unwilling or unable to commit to full-time "bricks and mortar" study, I cannot but suspect that it will be far less attractive to full-time workers already coping with family and rent or mortgage costs (who would want an additional £15,000 loan hanging over their heads?).
As for those like myself seeking "self improvement" (YUK!) as opposed to career advancement, it will simply be too much of a luxury. In the long run the country is thereby poorer. Further or Higher Education Colleges have long since pulled out from that "market". It is difficult to envisage Open Learn (as good as it is) filling the gap.Pehaps it is a luxury the country can no longer afford thanks to our shipping so many jobs abroad and replacing them with a "smoke and mirrors" industry run by incompetents who had no real idea what they were doing.
Jillian Mitchell - Tue, 02/08/2011 - 12:18
I am doing a one off module 2011-2012 which will be at the current cost. If I register for another one off module for autumn 2012 I will not be eligible for a government loan - I have 2 first degrees and a MA already and am currently studying part-time for a PhD - but would still be eligible to put fees on a OUSBA account. Will OUSBA increase the time allowed to pay back the course loan as obviously the monthly repayments will go up substantially.
Jane Matthews - Tue, 02/08/2011 - 12:24
Hi Jillian, I will pass your comment on to our Director of Finance. Certainly the OU has said it will look at whether it needs to enhance OUSBA in any way.
Jane
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Jane Matthews
Platform home team
Chris Mills - Tue, 02/08/2011 - 12:30
I have just completed my second year with OU and can't to get started on year three, with three more after that. Fortunately for me I got in just in time, because there's absolutely no way that I would have started my degree two years ago if it had cost £2500 per year - it just wouldn't have been practical.
My degree is not in any way vocational. When asked the question, "what would you have done differently in your life given the chance?" I always said that I would have gone to uni. The OU has given me the opportunity to do that, and I think it is exceptionally sad that many people like me will not get that chance in years to come. It seems like this decision could see the end of the OU in a decade or so.
Chris
Dawn Rothwell - Tue, 02/08/2011 - 13:50
I think it's terrible that the costs are going up so much. For myself I am very grateful that I am on my last course starting in October so I will have managed to get my degree without paying such an awful lot of money.
As many OUers I have only managed to get through this studying and working full-time by sheer determination and huge amounts of hard work (I have collected many new grey hairs on my head as a result!). And I have only been able to manage the monthly payments as long as I was working full time! But it would have been a lot harder with these increased fees. I can only imagine that it will only be those privileged enough to have money to spare that will be able to pay for OU now.
I think it is so unfair that not having enough money means not being able to study (and, if you do, you end up in vast amounts of debt) so only better-off people will in future ever be able to afford any kind of higher education in this country. How short-sighted.
Shame on this government.
Ray Brown - Tue, 02/08/2011 - 15:31
Hi there. I'm returning to the OU this year to start a new science degree. I've paid for the first year 70 points. What do the transitional arrangements mean? Will fees remain at the low price for me for the life of the probable six year degree or will they go up half way through? Would be glad if anyone could advise.
The OU of needs to understand that students are not wealthy, so it's should to be careful thought behind such moves and there is a need to take care to inform accordingly. Keep in mind also of student travel mainly by public transport and no by electric vehicles so to begin using car charging station makes the whole process expensive and problematic for the public of student.
Helen Ward - Tue, 02/08/2011 - 16:14
Science Practicals
Does the new system mean that the OU will reconsider its decision to do away with residential courses for science students? The argument was that these were run at a loss doesn't hold water if they are able to charge realistic fees that can be covered by loans.
Mature Students
On the plus side, the loan system may be of particular benefit to mature students who are well into their working life and who may, therefore, have to repay little or nothing unless they retire on banker's pensions.
On the minus side, OU provides a valuable opportunity for people to continue their education after graduation and, indeed, after retirement. As other posters have mentioned, the new arrangements seem designed to put these people off. We keep being reminded that we live in an aging society - there must be benefits in encouraging people to remain intellectualy and socially engaged.
Brian Wright - Tue, 02/08/2011 - 16:56
I have been studying with the OU since 1991, doing various (mainly maths) courses at UG and PG levels. My intention before today's announcement was to finish this year's course, then do a 60 credit course next year, followed by a 30 credit course, which, hopefully, would get me a first class honours degree. I already have enough credits for a degree, but some of the grades were not what I wanted, as the OU withdrew the MMath several years back, forcing me to try to stuff 60-90 credits into each year to finish before they pulled it. So now I'll likely be told I've already got enough credits for a degree, and so can't continue with my plans without paying another £3,750 for two more courses. It's the second time that changes have been put through that don't take account of the long-term nature of a part-time OU degree. I couldn't justify paying the new fee levels, as I don't 'need' the degree. I'll be sad to leave the OU without getting the degree that I'd been planning.
I concur with the comments of those who feel the fee changes will be deleterious to the OU - the OU was never designed to be a 'competitor' of full-time universities. Rather, it was aimed at those who wouldn't consider full-time university, for whatever reason. I think most prospective students in that category will find alternatives like the University of London's International Programme much more financially attractive after these changes. Also, I suspect that many interesting but "not useful" courses will disappear through lack of demand. Who can justify paying £1,250 - £2,500 for a Classical Greek or Latin course? So, many interesting courses will disappear, leaving only those courses that are vocationally oriented. There's more to life (and, I thought, the OU) than simply preparing people for jobs.
George Watson - Tue, 02/08/2011 - 20:04
Mature Students
I agree with some of the previous comments about this area of activity.
MATURE STUDENTS
It is really sad to see the result of this fees increase which will have a knock-on for those who use the OU for keeping their intellects active, pursuing interests that they could not undertake because of work commitments, bringing up children etc etc. Now that they are mainly free of these constraints a whole window of new stimulation opens up as they study in the arts, social sciences, languages portfolioes etc etc. Then that window is not only closed but the blinds are drawn down as the costs involved in keeping intellectual active become prohibitive. Has any one at the OU championed the mature non-vocational student?
This is not about career enhancement, it is not just about a vocational mind set (both certainly important). It is also about education in its wider sense, about developing the whole person and giving opportunities to learn, especially to a sector of society who are increasingly marginalised by on-going Government policies in health, social care and now education.
Luckily I finish my degree this year but as I am retired I was looking forward to continuing my studies by picking off subjects which took my fancy for one reason or another over the coming years - I am afraid that will probably be no longer possible (unless my pension increases substantially or I win the lottery!!)
Jennie Lee must be turning in her grave.
George
Gordon Hughes - Fri, 05/08/2011 - 16:22
I consider the OU is looking to increase revenue by charging what it considers the traffic will bear. Without a sight of the financial numbers, in particular the previous average government contribution to undergraduate modules, it is not possible to say to what extent there is a straight transfer of cost from the government to the individual student. I am not against this in the case of 'recreational' learners like my self but have always been dubious at the level of the fees charged by the OU and I am now completly staggered by them. The OU must, when setting the 60 point fee of £2500, have been conducting a pure top-down exercise, ie what can we now get away with as a fee vis-a-vis the fees of other institutions. If you take the direct costs of any course, particularly as a pittance of a few hundred pounds per student is paid to tutors, the overheads allowed for are huge and disproportionate, even taking into account the development and the publication of materials, as these costs can be absorbed over its length and hence a great number of students. I consider that there is and has always been much scope for efficiencies. A detailed breakdown of OU expenditure would, I think, be most illuminating as would the basis of their internal budget setting and accountabilty. In addition a sight of some illustrative examples of a bottom up costing of typical modules would aid in gaining an understanding of how the fees relate to costs.
Note to self - I will not make unfriendly comments about
Nick Clegg
Though fee increases are never welcome, I think a degree for £15K isn't as bad as it could have been...
I like that part-time study will be proprortionally priced - half of the study for half of the fee...
As a current student, I like the transitional arrangements.
I was wondering if the new fees apply to all courses equally?
What about courses like business and law - will a 60 point/credit course in these subjects be £2,500 or will fees be higher?
I'm a law student - so I'm kind of curious.
EDIT 25.07.11: Just got an email from Open University General Enquiries. For those interested in law courses with the OU, the 2012 fees for law modules are also set at £2,500 - not cheap, but as law modules in the past have been more expensive than other subjects, the fee doesn't seem too bad.....
I'm interested in how they are going to manage to get the large number of career changers who did their first degrees ten or twenty years ago. The new loan system states that you cannot have a degree in order to be eligible. A large number of OU students have already got a first degree, so without these students the OU is going to struggle.
I am glad I am just coming to the end of my degree but I feel sorry for all those people who are unhappy in their current jobs or have experienced a decline in their sector and now cannot afford to have a career change. I am sure we will see an increase in rates of depression in the years to come from this change.
Some people won't be able to study with the new fees, so that is so sad...
this increase is applied to the postgrade studies too?
No, the changes to higher education funding affect only undergraduate courses in England. If you go to http://www8.open.ac.uk/study/explained/fees-2012/new-to-study and look down the page you'll find more information about postgraduate funding and the new fees in general.
Yvonne
Platform team
How does distance learning, where one tutorial per month (if that at times) and a set of books/cds cost £2,500? Putting up the cost more than three times than the original price is disgusting.
As a Young Student Ambassador I am concerned that the OU have no idea how much this will affect younger students. I have questioned a few students from my old secondary school since hearing this, and they all said this:
"Why would I want to spend £5,000 a year for studying at home, irregular contact with tutors and hardly any face to face interaction with students, when I can pay a bit more and get so much more at campus universities? I thought the OU was a more economical way of getting a degree?"
It's sad but true - the gap between the cost of an OU degree and a campus uni degree is getting narrower, and the OU will pay for it, big time.
Hayley, I agree with what you're saying, just at a point where The OU was seeming like an affordable alternative for many younger students this happens.
I do however think that the student who made the comment about paying a little more to go to a campus university needs to remember that even at £5k per year (FTE) The OU is still 45% cheaper than the highest charging universities (of which there are an increasing amount!) so The OU is STILL by far the most affordable alternative.
I'm hoping this will actually work in The OU's favour. Percentage differences between OU and brick unis are still similar but in terms of actual hard earned (or worse borrowed!) £££'s the gap has suddenly shot up from £1800 to £4000 per YEAR. That's a difference of £12000 over a 3 year degree, that's a year's salary for some people!!
I really do think we need to be mindful of that fact. Does that student you questionned really want to pay an extra £12000 PLUS accommodation fees and living expenses just to be able to have a bit more of a social life? I wouldn't.
It's not just for a 'bit more of a social life' though is it? It's access to all the brick uni facilities as opposed to sitting at home ready a book.
I was lucky enough to get a OU degree a couple of years ago. In a couple of years from now my kids will be uni age. There is no way I will allow them to pay £5K a year for what the OU has to offer.
The whole big debt thing is a bit misleading isn't it? If you owe £15K for a OU degree or £30K for a 'proper' degree the monthly repayments are the same. Only differnce is you will probably clear the OU debt within the 30 year limit while the 'big' debt will be wiped after this time anyway.
It's not just for a 'bit more of a social life' though is it? It's access to all the brick uni facilities as opposed to sitting at home ready a book
What extra facilities do brick unis offer? Let's look at your list of L's and see where they differ from The OU:
Lectures - Well The OU DOES offer lectures (tutorials) and due to the nature of The OU they're tailored to suit part time students in that they're usually out of normal working hours or online. The OU was never designed to cater itself predominantly for full time students the same way a brick uni does...
Lecturers - What do my module tutors and central academics do all day then if they're not lecturers? Are they not there to help me and answer any queries I have regarding the module?
Libraries - As an OU student you can get access to ANY library within the COUNTRY if you so desire, so aside from the online library and the one at Walton Hall I, for example, could borrow books from Newcastle University Library. If you don't believe me check here http://library.open.ac.uk/help/otherlibs/index.cfm
Laboratories - admittedly this is a more limited one, but there's residential courses for those academic fields which may require lab time so provisions ARE attempted...
I think you're missing the entire point of The OU here though, it's not meant to be the same as a brick university, it's not aimed at the same market so the competition it has with brick unis is limited. It's designed for folks like me who work full time, don't have the time or financial freedom to be able to attend a brick uni but who still want the opportunity to study and earn a qualification in the time around the more important commitments.
This isn't aimed at you in particular, but I'm already fed up of people saying they're disappointed in the OU for what THEY'VE put fees up by. Let's clarify something here - this wasn't The OU's doing, it was the governments... The OU didn't have a choice in the matter.
However, for those cynics among you who'd like to know where the £2500 for a 60 pointer is derived from I may just have to waggle my OUSA wand and see if we can get a breakdown of costs so we can settle that debate once and for all
I have to agree with Hayley's comment. With the PT fees up at £2500 for the provision of the book, DVD, online stuff, limited access to a tutor, no bricks and mortar for those who live a long way from Milton Keynes and marking of assignments - how can that fee be justified?
Most of the material is self-taught with nothing more than a sophisticated distance learning arrangement.
PT study with the OU is seriously going to be impacted. If this was the fee for my last year then I wouldn't have started in the first place.
Could spell the end of this part of the OU.
This comment from Nikki on her blog seems to sum up the general feeling…
"I have to be honest… these changes anger me. I am not, in any way, angry at the OU. These changes will not affect me. But I am angry for the group of kids who happen to be a couple of years younger than me and will pay over twice as much for the same standard of education that I received. I am angry at the government who received their education for free. I feel our generation is being left behind by previous generations who had everything handed to them on a golden platter."
__________________
Robyn Bateman (member of the Platform team)
I must admit I was really shocked to see how much the new fees are. I think this will put off a lot of potential students. If the fees had been this high when I started my degree there is no way I could have afforded it. I think that the OU will really struggle to attract students.
Jo
Paying 5/8th or 5/9th of the fees expected from a traditional University is a very high proportion. Time will tell whether this is low enough to convince young students to opt for what the OU can offer, that is printed text, online support and occasional tutorials.
I imagine that this will, for most, be a poor second choice to actually attending University with all it has to offer, both inside and outside of the lectures. The student experience of 'attending' uni will be lost to those who opt for the OU.
I'm told the OU has yet to make a decision on the new fee level for 10- and 15-point courses, but if they rise in proportion to the 30- and 60-pointers, i.e. by about x3.5, we could be looking at fees of £500-£700 just for an Openings course or a brief "taster". Who on earth is going to want - or be able to afford - that?
The reply I had from the OU seemed to work on the assumption that the majority of students who took these courses did them as one-offs or as a hobby interest, and reminded me that the revised fee structure is focused towards certificates, degrees and diplomas. The OU seems to be overlooking the point that many of these short courses can be counted towards the various certificates (e.g. Certificate of Higher Education in...) and even the Open BA, provided they don't account for more than 30 points at Level 1.
Also, does anybody see the much-mismanaged Tesco vouchers scheme continuing after September 2012? Or even continuing to provide practical financial support? At the moment, as a small-time Tesco Express shopper, I can build up £50-worth of vouchers over a two-year period, giving me £150 off a short course currently costing £170-£195. After September 2012, £150 off will scarcely make a dent for new students.
I really do feel that the new fee structure will penalise the very people who historically have most needed the OU: those on low incomes, striving to give themselves a second chance.
This is undoubtedly the darkest and most shameful hour in the OU's existence.
Well, so much for the 'Open' university! How 'open' is a fee of £2500? If fees had been at this level when I was with the OU I would never have started, and I think this is going to be the attitude of many in my situation, ie, working a nine to five ordinary job for a very average wage, but with an interest in developing a liking for history and literature. At, I think, £600 for a sixty point course in 2006 the OU system was a bargain. Now the 'not wanted' signs are going up at the OU for those very people it was first intended to attract! For some £2500 won't be a worry, for many more it is going to be a major disincentive. What a shame.
This new pricing is absolutely ridiculous. Someone doing two 60 point courses is going to have to pay £5,000?
It’s bad enough having to pay that sort of price for a full years education at a proper university, but at least that gets you access to all the facilities a ‘bricks and mortar’ uni has to offer. For example -
Lectures
Lecturers
Libraries
Laboratories
And that’s just the Ls.
What will the OU offer in return for this massive increase? Local evening tutorial several times a week? No? Didn’t think so.
The OU seems to think it will attract 'full time' students as the fees are lower than the top end uni's. But who is going to pay £5K to sit at home and read some books? Young students are more interested the the uni lifstyle than qualifications. S
I think this will be the beginning of the end for the OU.
David Cameron will now achieve what the Thatcher Government did not - the beginning of the end of the Open University.
I never thought that I would end up praising Margaret Thatcher on a public forum but ...
"Her most remarkable achievment" [ as Education Secratary] "was saving the Open University. The Tories in opposition had sneered at the projected 'university of the air' as a typical Wilsonian gimmick. Nor only Macleod, but even Boyle, had intended to scrap it. The libertariabn right ... regarded the OU as an unnecessary extension of state provision. But Mrs Thatcher ... was pursuaded, principally by Walter Perry - the OU's first Vice Chancellor - that it was a serious and worthwhile enterprise that would genuinely extend opportunity." (Campbell, 2007, p.229)
Campbell J., 2007, Margaret Thatcher Volume One : The Grocer's Daughter, London : Vintage Books
In response to the above:
Please note that I referred to "Mrs Thatcher's Government" not to the lady herself. It was the Government that offfered the choice between School Milk or the OU. I would heartily endorse your praise for her in that respect - an institution was saved at minor cost to most of the parents affected by the loss of school milk.
With fees now more than tripled, the nature of this world renowned institution must irrevocably change. Whilst the OU may well offer a cheaper and attractive option for "live at home" students unwilling or unable to commit to full-time "bricks and mortar" study, I cannot but suspect that it will be far less attractive to full-time workers already coping with family and rent or mortgage costs (who would want an additional £15,000 loan hanging over their heads?).
As for those like myself seeking "self improvement" (YUK!) as opposed to career advancement, it will simply be too much of a luxury. In the long run the country is thereby poorer. Further or Higher Education Colleges have long since pulled out from that "market". It is difficult to envisage Open Learn (as good as it is) filling the gap.Pehaps it is a luxury the country can no longer afford thanks to our shipping so many jobs abroad and replacing them with a "smoke and mirrors" industry run by incompetents who had no real idea what they were doing.
I am doing a one off module 2011-2012 which will be at the current cost. If I register for another one off module for autumn 2012 I will not be eligible for a government loan - I have 2 first degrees and a MA already and am currently studying part-time for a PhD - but would still be eligible to put fees on a OUSBA account. Will OUSBA increase the time allowed to pay back the course loan as obviously the monthly repayments will go up substantially.
Hi Jillian, I will pass your comment on to our Director of Finance. Certainly the OU has said it will look at whether it needs to enhance OUSBA in any way.
Jane
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Jane Matthews
Platform home team
I have just completed my second year with OU and can't to get started on year three, with three more after that. Fortunately for me I got in just in time, because there's absolutely no way that I would have started my degree two years ago if it had cost £2500 per year - it just wouldn't have been practical.
My degree is not in any way vocational. When asked the question, "what would you have done differently in your life given the chance?" I always said that I would have gone to uni. The OU has given me the opportunity to do that, and I think it is exceptionally sad that many people like me will not get that chance in years to come. It seems like this decision could see the end of the OU in a decade or so.
Chris
I think it's terrible that the costs are going up so much. For myself I am very grateful that I am on my last course starting in October so I will have managed to get my degree without paying such an awful lot of money.
As many OUers I have only managed to get through this studying and working full-time by sheer determination and huge amounts of hard work (I have collected many new grey hairs on my head as a result!). And I have only been able to manage the monthly payments as long as I was working full time! But it would have been a lot harder with these increased fees. I can only imagine that it will only be those privileged enough to have money to spare that will be able to pay for OU now.
I think it is so unfair that not having enough money means not being able to study (and, if you do, you end up in vast amounts of debt) so only better-off people will in future ever be able to afford any kind of higher education in this country. How short-sighted.
Shame on this government.
Hi there. I'm returning to the OU this year to start a new science degree. I've paid for the first year 70 points. What do the transitional arrangements mean? Will fees remain at the low price for me for the life of the probable six year degree or will they go up half way through? Would be glad if anyone could advise.
Hi Ray. Here's a link to the Fees 2012 website which has a information and a video explaining what the transitional arrangements mean for current students: http://www8.open.ac.uk/study/explained/fees-2012/currently-studying
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Robyn Bateman (member of the Platform team)
Thank you for that Robyn.
The OU of needs to understand that students are not wealthy, so it's should to be careful thought behind such moves and there is a need to take care to inform accordingly. Keep in mind also of student travel mainly by public transport and no by electric vehicles so to begin using car charging station makes the whole process expensive and problematic for the public of student.
Science Practicals
Does the new system mean that the OU will reconsider its decision to do away with residential courses for science students? The argument was that these were run at a loss doesn't hold water if they are able to charge realistic fees that can be covered by loans.
Mature Students
On the plus side, the loan system may be of particular benefit to mature students who are well into their working life and who may, therefore, have to repay little or nothing unless they retire on banker's pensions.
On the minus side, OU provides a valuable opportunity for people to continue their education after graduation and, indeed, after retirement. As other posters have mentioned, the new arrangements seem designed to put these people off. We keep being reminded that we live in an aging society - there must be benefits in encouraging people to remain intellectualy and socially engaged.
I have been studying with the OU since 1991, doing various (mainly maths) courses at UG and PG levels. My intention before today's announcement was to finish this year's course, then do a 60 credit course next year, followed by a 30 credit course, which, hopefully, would get me a first class honours degree. I already have enough credits for a degree, but some of the grades were not what I wanted, as the OU withdrew the MMath several years back, forcing me to try to stuff 60-90 credits into each year to finish before they pulled it. So now I'll likely be told I've already got enough credits for a degree, and so can't continue with my plans without paying another £3,750 for two more courses. It's the second time that changes have been put through that don't take account of the long-term nature of a part-time OU degree. I couldn't justify paying the new fee levels, as I don't 'need' the degree. I'll be sad to leave the OU without getting the degree that I'd been planning.
I concur with the comments of those who feel the fee changes will be deleterious to the OU - the OU was never designed to be a 'competitor' of full-time universities. Rather, it was aimed at those who wouldn't consider full-time university, for whatever reason. I think most prospective students in that category will find alternatives like the University of London's International Programme much more financially attractive after these changes. Also, I suspect that many interesting but "not useful" courses will disappear through lack of demand. Who can justify paying £1,250 - £2,500 for a Classical Greek or Latin course? So, many interesting courses will disappear, leaving only those courses that are vocationally oriented. There's more to life (and, I thought, the OU) than simply preparing people for jobs.
Mature Students
I agree with some of the previous comments about this area of activity.
MATURE STUDENTS
It is really sad to see the result of this fees increase which will have a knock-on for those who use the OU for keeping their intellects active, pursuing interests that they could not undertake because of work commitments, bringing up children etc etc. Now that they are mainly free of these constraints a whole window of new stimulation opens up as they study in the arts, social sciences, languages portfolioes etc etc. Then that window is not only closed but the blinds are drawn down as the costs involved in keeping intellectual active become prohibitive. Has any one at the OU championed the mature non-vocational student?
This is not about career enhancement, it is not just about a vocational mind set (both certainly important). It is also about education in its wider sense, about developing the whole person and giving opportunities to learn, especially to a sector of society who are increasingly marginalised by on-going Government policies in health, social care and now education.
Luckily I finish my degree this year but as I am retired I was looking forward to continuing my studies by picking off subjects which took my fancy for one reason or another over the coming years - I am afraid that will probably be no longer possible (unless my pension increases substantially or I win the lottery!!)
Jennie Lee must be turning in her grave.
George
I consider the OU is looking to increase revenue by charging what it considers the traffic will bear. Without a sight of the financial numbers, in particular the previous average government contribution to undergraduate modules, it is not possible to say to what extent there is a straight transfer of cost from the government to the individual student. I am not against this in the case of 'recreational' learners like my self but have always been dubious at the level of the fees charged by the OU and I am now completly staggered by them. The OU must, when setting the 60 point fee of £2500, have been conducting a pure top-down exercise, ie what can we now get away with as a fee vis-a-vis the fees of other institutions. If you take the direct costs of any course, particularly as a pittance of a few hundred pounds per student is paid to tutors, the overheads allowed for are huge and disproportionate, even taking into account the development and the publication of materials, as these costs can be absorbed over its length and hence a great number of students. I consider that there is and has always been much scope for efficiencies. A detailed breakdown of OU expenditure would, I think, be most illuminating as would the basis of their internal budget setting and accountabilty. In addition a sight of some illustrative examples of a bottom up costing of typical modules would aid in gaining an understanding of how the fees relate to costs.
Gordon
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